Transmission Issues / Recall

[Beaullieu]

I have an 02 Odyssey that is regularly serviced by a private shop owned by former Honda Service Manager. He has shared with me some horror stories of 1999-03 Odyssey owners having transmission issues. Mine was recalled and my mechanic is telling me to expect a failure before I get 125k miles. I've got 105k now. He also advised that there is a class action lawsuit (in CA) on the transmission issue that caused Honda to extend the transmission warranty to 109k mi for vehicles in the recall.

I've read a bit on this topic on the Edmunds Town Hall and have seen owners getting varying degrees of assistance from Honda. Some got a free rebuilt unit, some paid labor only and some paid full load of nearly $4k.

I would like for this thread to be for owners to share their experience if they have had transmission issues on a 1999-03 Odyssey and to also share how best to get Honda to provide assistance for transmission failures.

Mine has not yet failed but I'm now apprehensive......

[sixtn39]

At 46K I had a transmission failure with a previously owned '02 Odyssey EX-L. Fortunately, I had a Hondacare extended warranty and all was made well by Honda. I sold it in Dec 2006 at 75K and it was performing excellently.

Honda has in the past replaced transmissions on a "goodwill" basis, but that seems to be the exception lately. Owners can expect that Honda will replace the trans, but the owner will be responsible for about $800 in labor costs.

Current owners can help their case by utilizing a Honda dealer for transmission service, by only using Honda Z-1 transmission fluid, by performing more frequent than recommended transmission services (many are drain and filling at 15K intervals), maintaining all service records and if the dealer doesn't go to bat for them, to personally contact Honda customer service contacts in the owner's manual.

The secret to prevention seems to be keeping the trans fluid very clean.

[rfdixon]

I have a green 99 Odyssey with 124k miles that I bought new. Let me start by saying, though my wife and I have had a number of issues over the years (particularly the auto rear sliding door electronics and the transmission), overall we have been extremely happy with our purchase. My wife and 3 kids have really put the car through it over 8 years, it is beginning to show it's age, but if it were to die tomorrow we would probably purchase another Odyssey anyway.This is mainly due to our experience with our other Hondas over the years, and our dealer's (and Honda's) reaction when we did have an issue.

As for the transmission, the original transmission went out @38k miles, just outside of Honda's 3 year 36k mile warranty. Without asking our dealer told us Honda was replacing the transmission at no charge to us. Of course I don't believe the dealer just got a sudden case of charitable goodwill. I know at the time the transmission issue was known to dealers and they were trying to head off potential bigger issues. Also, I have 2 other cars from this dealer and regularly used their service department. Still, it was handled the way I think it should have been handled without me even having to ask.

Like I said, the Odyssey now has 124k miles. I don't drive it very often (it is my wife's vehicle), however I have noticed the transmission is starting to slip the last couple of times I have driven it. This transmission has approximately 88k miles on it. My wife and I have had an 87 Civic we sold with 125k miles, a 90 Accord we sold with 192k miles, and a 92 Accord we sold with 140k miles. We have never had one other transmission problem, ever. All our vehicle we have serviced regularly, and changed transmission fluid at recommended intervals. I am not sure what is going on with the transmission on this era Odyssey, but if any Honda with 124k miles that has been serviced at scheduled intervals is in need of its 3rd transmission, there is a problem.

[HondaTech]

My belief on this matter - and it's nothing official - is that the design of the transmission remained essentially unchanged for years and years. However the size and weight of the vehicles continued to increase, as did the load and towing capacity and engine power and torque. Basically, the transmission wasn't evolving at the same rate as the rest of the vehicle, and became a weak link. Minor changes were implemented in '02 but it was not until 05 that a complete redesign came through and hopefully ended most of the transmission issues that had plagued the earlier model years.

Thats theory 1.

Theory 2 says that when they started manufacturing the transmissions in the US instead of in japan... the problems began. Chalk it up to poor tolerances, dirty work environments or too many Monday morning hangovers.... whatever the case, Honda needed to fix it. Ergo, they built a place called Honda Precision Parts of Georgia.... a dedicated transmission facility designed and built the Honda way. Hopefully also managed the Honda way and producing the familiar quality associated with Honda.


HT

[cebit]

My belief on this matter - and it's nothing official - is that the design of the transmission remained essentially unchanged for years and years. However the size and weight of the vehicles continued to increase, as did the load and towing capacity and engine power and torque.

Could be for the 99-01 4 speed AT.

Minor changes were implemented in '02

In 2002, Odyssey changed to a 5 speed AT similar to Acura MDX and Acura TL/CL. TL /CL had an astounding 25% failure rate according to Consumer Reports. Some failed more than once. MDX many problems too.

Theory 2 says that when they started manufacturing the transmissions in the US instead of in japan... the problems began.

All 1999-2004 Odyssey transmissions made in Japan. Newer ones?

Chalk it up to poor tolerances, dirty work environments or too many Monday morning hangovers.... whatever the case, Honda needed to fix it. Ergo, they built a place called Honda Precision Parts of Georgia.... a dedicated transmission facility designed and built the Honda way. Hopefully also managed the Honda way and producing the familiar quality associated with Honda.

Some co workers and soccer moms and dads have commented on their Odyssey transmissions failing. I hope quality is up. Profits and sales are up. So Honda should be able to afford to repair the old broken units. None of my fellow soccer moms and dads expected to buy a Honda and have the transmission fail so soon. Just trading in the old van for a new 2008 model is not the answer. Honda owners like to feel that they can continue almost trouble free ownership until they get tired of the car. That's what they did with their 15 year Accords.

[gstovall]

My 2001 Odyssey transmission went 145K miles before needing work. At that point, I opted for a Honda rebuilt transmission rather than a shop rebuild. I'm currently at 162K miles.

A local lube shop gave me a scare at 60K miles. They did an oil and transmission fluid change, and only put a quart of transmission fluid back in. Immediately started having problems, of course. I limped it how, then had it towed to the local Honda technician, who said that some of the pads had suffered some burning. But we had no idea how much life it took off the transmission, so we just were pretty rigid with a 15K mile transmission fluid change schedule after that.

[gchalk]

We have an '03 and got the recall notice, took it in, and re re-programmed the computer, less than 24 hours later the check engine light came on, and thay had to do the repair to the actual transmission, something about changing the fliud path so it kept the gears cooler. Anyway, at 109K miles, it's been a good van, my '97 CRV make it 201K miles in 10 years, which I recently upgraded to a Ridgeline...go Honda!

[rfdixon]

I took our Odyssey ('99 with 121K) in today for 120K service and sure enough, as I suspected, the transmission needs to be replaced. The dealer quoted $2800 ($2000 for the transmission and $800 for labor).We called Honda customer service and requested they pick up part of the tab based on the fact that we have been loyal Honda buyers for 20 years, we have maintained regular service on the Odyssey, and this will be the third transmission in the vehicle in 120K miles.Customer service said we should hear back with a response in 1-2 days.

I also called the sales person at the dealership, who I bought my last 2 cars from to see what kind of deals he had in case we wanted to cut our losses and trade in on a new vehicle. He offered to talk to the dealership service department manager and see if the service manager had any ideas.

By the time I talked to the service manager he had called customer service and he informed me Honda was taking care of the transmission parts and all I had to cover was the labor.

To top it off, the salesman arranged for us to have a loaner Odyssey for the next week while the transmission is being replaced. I am stunned that my nearly 9 year old Odyssey needs it's 3rd transmission, but I am glad I have a solid dealership who stands behind their customers and is interested in building long standing relationships. I know they are in the business of selling and servicing Hondas, but they have their eye on the long ball. They have certainly gone out of their way to earn my trust and businessfor the long term.

[chiody]

Recently returned from the dealer with a new remanufactured tranny and torque converter in our 01' with 102K miles replaced at no cost due to the recall and lawsuits.

I've maintained this Ody with more than the required Z1 drain and fills (every 7.5K-15K-singles, 2 3X complete exchanges) plus have had a Magnefine filter downstream on the return line and had hoped for a longer life but no go. This was the 1st replacement tranny FWIW.

For the 1st 85K, original tranny functioned flawlessly. The last 17K, I perceived a noticeable whine in 1st gear that increased in pitch till the shift. Also at highway speeds for the last 5K was a whine in 4th gear in overdrive between 75-80 mph. I'd imagine THIS was a sure indicator of something about to happen as to hear it inside with all the road and mechanical noises abound, it must have been pretty loud after all. Shifting between F/R has been fine with no clunking even on sub-freezing days though.

Last Friday I drove out on a typical 20 degree morning and within 1/4 mile the TCS, CEL, and D4 light came on after I went over our alley speed check bump. As I tried to turn left, the tranny slipped as if it was in neutral though the vehicle progressed slowly. Upon shutting off the engine and immediately restarting, the CEL remained and all lights turned off.

Interestingly, the rest of the weekend for over 300 miles of driving the tranny functioned as before with no more problems. Of course that morning I took it in and the dealer started the paperwork to authorize a replacement.

Upon notifying me of the part arrival, dropped it off on Tues. morning with the anticipation of completion by Wed. evening, which WAS accomplished.

Upon driving off the lot, I immediately pulled over to inspect things. Was curious to see what they did with my Magnefine filter and noted a entirely new return line installed by the radiator with the old output line remaining.

I then listened carefully and drove for about 20 blocks starting and stopping shifting through 2 or 3 gears. The 1st gear whine was still there though it was hardly noticeable. Shifting was smooth and positive as expected. Upon reaching the on ramp of the expressway I eased on in 2nd gear and punched it to check downshifting with a positive smooth engadgement and perfect 6K rpm upshift at about 50 mph. Proceeded to drive between 70-90 mph to check on the high speed whine and noted it had all disappeared.

Arriving home I drove onto the ramps to inspect underneath out of curiosity. Interestingly this trannies case had not been repainted but was rather quite dirty. I noted the new drain bolt and many of the mounting bolts had new white paint on it. The sub case housing the torque converter was marked "new" and definitely looked it. Also noted a series of white Honda markings and numbers were on several locations.

Had left the vehicle in park during this examination for about 15 mins. having the fan cycle on and off for several cycles.

Then I noticed some tranny fluid had formed a small droplet between the torque coverter housing and engine! I wiped off the area and observed for another 10 mins. and it seems like there is some very minor leak....DRATS! Not the way to end this saga!

Perhaps there was some fluid spilled from the exchange? Nevertheless I will watch carefully the next day or so and if it continues, will have the dealer address this issue.

Upon checking out had me sign a work order outlining Honda's costs but I was not allowed to keep a copy? Mine had the same information but no figures listed, so I took it upon myself to write them on my form just for reference.

Below is the pertinent data with the INTERNAL costs for this exchange and what Honda is ALLOWING this dealer for labor rates/reimbursement:

Tranny/Torque Converter Exchange Kit - $1,370
Labor at 6.5 hrs. - $632

Wheel alignment .6 hrs. - $58
Clean Rad/Tran Cooler .3 hrs. - $29

ATF Z1 $7 Qt. - $36

Freight $107

Note the sub $100 shop rate, which is LESS than what they usually charge...Chicago has some pretty humongous labor rates....

In conclusion, this tranny shifts really nicely and all the quirks of the old one are essentially gone. Just will monitor the leak and address it if it remains....

Morning After Followup Report....

Last night before I took it out for a 26 mile errand, a quarter sized spot of tranny fluid was observed on the floor. Confirmed the source was the tranny/block location.

Returned to see that engine area was dry, perhaps due to the wind from the drive?

8 hours later this morning, NO MORE TRANNY FLUID, on the floor nor at the tranny casing/engine block!

Will continue to monitor but feel much better now.....

[MTPockets08]

Hey chiody, good to see you here! The reliabilty of that other board is as horrible as these Honda Ody transaxles! Yup, hopefully your ATF issue was just some spillage from installation and will cease to exist. IMO- the worst part of these Ody trans replacements is; the replacements appear to be units of identical [defective] design as the factory installed! That's just plain wrong. I'm all for regular trans maintenance, but as said, this does not help these units much. As far as I've read/seen, the first major 'redesign' didn't happen until 2007. 2007+ Ody's use a trans derived from the 4x4 Ridgeline. The case is totally different, it has 4 gear shaft as opposed to 3 and the trans ATF filter is different and more user friendly. Hopefully this helps long-term reliability. My take on year/compatability is; they can't slap a 2007+ trans on the earlier models due to mechanical and electronics changes.

Joel